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Thread: April showers bring May flowers so they say. It just makes me sneeze alot

  1. #31
    Quote Originally Posted by kirinke View Post
    It would really depend on your lifestyle. Do you like outdoor activities? Choose the fire-striker.
    If you're more indoors, choose the ring bottle opener. It also depends on if you have one already.

    Otherwise, either are cool gifts.


    I'm asking everyone here who reads that post what their personal preference would be, in case that wasn't perfectly crystalline-clear.

    Dark the stars and dark the moon
    Hush the night and the morning loon
    Tell the horses and beat on your drum
    Gone their master, gone their son.

    Dark the oceans, dark the sky
    Hush the whales and the ocean tide
    Tell the salt marsh and beat on your drum
    Gone their master, gone their son.


 

  • #32
    can't be bothered Eldorian's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Palaralae View Post
    Quick question open to everyone; if someone were to give you the choice of either a small magnesium fire striker, or a plain steel ring that was a bottle-opener as a wee giftie or small-trade item, which would you prefer, and any reason(s) why? Need to gather some data.


    No, I don't want to bother with putting up a poll.
    Both of those sound like things I'd set on my desk and never use, and eventually put into a storage box in the basement when I get around to clearing my desk of the nonsense on it I don't use.

  • #33
    self admitted prolifer kirinke's Avatar
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    I'm asking everyone here who reads that post what their personal preference would be, in case that wasn't perfectly crystalline-clear.
    I thought I did?
    If I were an outdoorsy type, I go with the firestarter.
    If I wasn't, I'd go with the bottlecap opener.
    Personally, I'd go with the bottlecap opener, cuz I don't ever see myself needing a firestarter.
    Madness does not always howl. Sometimes, it is the quiet voice at the end of the day saying, "Hey, is there room in your head for one more?"

    I is before E except after C, then it's chaos man, mass chaos! Letters coming together into words, but then you go English and they put U's in places that just shouldn't go there... AHHHHHH!!!!!!!!

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  • #34
    56% of an excuse nail bunny's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Palaralae View Post
    Quick question open to everyone; if someone were to give you the choice of either a small magnesium fire striker, or a plain steel ring that was a bottle-opener as a wee giftie or small-trade item, which would you prefer, and any reason(s) why? Need to gather some data.
    Bottle opener ring.

    Everyone can start a fire. Not everyone can open a bottle wiff t'ere teef.
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  • #35
    Quote Originally Posted by kirinke View Post
    Personally, I'd go with the bottlecap opener, cuz I don't ever see myself needing a firestarter.
    See how fucking easy that was?

    Thanks.

    Dark the stars and dark the moon
    Hush the night and the morning loon
    Tell the horses and beat on your drum
    Gone their master, gone their son.

    Dark the oceans, dark the sky
    Hush the whales and the ocean tide
    Tell the salt marsh and beat on your drum
    Gone their master, gone their son.


  • #36
    Quote Originally Posted by nail bunny View Post
    Bottle opener ring.

    Everyone can start a fire. Not everyone can open a bottle wiff t'ere teef.
    Excellent point, thank you.

    (can't throw rep your way again right yet)

    Dark the stars and dark the moon
    Hush the night and the morning loon
    Tell the horses and beat on your drum
    Gone their master, gone their son.

    Dark the oceans, dark the sky
    Hush the whales and the ocean tide
    Tell the salt marsh and beat on your drum
    Gone their master, gone their son.


  • #37
    Quote Originally Posted by Palaralae View Post
    Quick question open to everyone; if someone were to give you the choice of either a small magnesium fire striker, or a plain steel ring that was a bottle-opener as a wee giftie or small-trade item, which would you prefer, and any reason(s) why? Need to gather some data.
    Fire striker. nail bunny's reasoning is flawed; there are plenty of tools to open a bottle, so it's not a binary choice between metal ring and teef. On the other hand, when you really want to set some idiot on fire, a reliable striker is just the thing.
    Fiat justitia ruat coelum.

  • #38
    56% of an excuse nail bunny's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Advocatus Diaboli View Post
    Fire striker. nail bunny's reasoning is flawed; there are plenty of tools to open a bottle, so it's not a binary choice between metal ring and teef. On the other hand, when you really want to set some idiot on fire, a reliable striker is just the thing.
    Inversely, fire lighters are literally ubiquitous in lighters. Which even when dry have a flint striker (not as good as magnesium fire rod though). And most people do not carry bottle opening tools.

    I mean I do... but I also have a magnesium fire rod, two lighters, 20 strike anywhere waxed matches... plenty of tinder... in my EDC. A P-38 on my keyring and a small combo church key-can opener*.



    * Fucking thing is a pain in the balls to use, my P-38 is far, far easier to open cans with. But it has a church key on it, so I've kept it.
    I can delete you, one click and you're overwritten.

  • #39
    Quote Originally Posted by nail bunny View Post
    Inversely, fire lighters are literally ubiquitous in lighters. Which even when dry have a flint striker (not as good as magnesium fire rod though). And most people do not carry bottle opening tools.

    I mean I do... but I also have a magnesium fire rod, two lighters, 20 strike anywhere waxed matches... plenty of tinder... in my EDC. A P-38 on my keyring and a small combo church key-can opener*.

    * Fucking thing is a pain in the balls to use, my P-38 is far, far easier to open cans with. But it has a church key on it, so I've kept it.
    There's a smart lad.


    I'm trying to decide between these (though what the hell, I may end up just getting a 10/12-pack of both) for Wasteland easy/generic gifts and small trade items. I figured everybody would think the ring bottle openers were cool, hell, I was introduced to them by one of my camp neighbors last year when I had to dig to crack open a cider, which is where I got the idea of having them. Wasn't so sure everyone would appreciate the strikers, though I got one of the cheapie magnesium strikers a couple years ago as a stocking stuffer and I thought it was a great idea, definitely one of my top 5 fave useful/practical stocking stuffers I've gotten.

    Hmmm, I wonder if a P-38 might not be a good idea/alternative, too. I think I saw those pretty cheap/bulk in the last Sportsman'sGuide catalog I got when I picked up the koppeltragegestelle closeout deal they were having.

    Dark the stars and dark the moon
    Hush the night and the morning loon
    Tell the horses and beat on your drum
    Gone their master, gone their son.

    Dark the oceans, dark the sky
    Hush the whales and the ocean tide
    Tell the salt marsh and beat on your drum
    Gone their master, gone their son.


  • #40
    56% of an excuse nail bunny's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Palaralae View Post
    I'm trying to decide between these (though what the hell, I may end up just getting a 10/12-pack of both) for Wasteland easy/generic gifts and small trade items.
    Ah, Wasteland gifts. Probably the ring would be a hit. Of the other two, how many Wastelanders seemed to be without fire versus without a can opener at given time?
    I can delete you, one click and you're overwritten.

  • #41
    Pony Up! Ovinomancer's Avatar
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    Fire striker. No reason....
    Quote Originally Posted by PWD View Post
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    I think ovi's right.

  • #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ovinomancer View Post
    Fire striker. No reason....

    Me, too. I have a bottle opener. And many bottle openers are of poor quality (like my "Beer to Eternity" opener from the store of the same name). My favorite says "Lucky Lager - Age Dated Beer/ It's Lucky when you live in America." Can't beat that with a stick. But aside from a box of matches, a fire starter can be useful. Depends on the situation.
    "When the subway jerks, it's the fixed stars that throw you down."

  • #43
    Just a random thought: We worry a lot about how technology might disrupt the future, how digitalization or AI could kill jobs, or how AI could at some point become uncontrollabe and un-understandable to us...
    But I wonder... When we invented wheels to make transporting stuff easier, did that ruin anyone's civilization? Or didn't we just find something to do to make our life even better with these new technologies, in the process also finding new jobs to fill.

    But maybe the real concern really has to be ecology - In this random thought I can't really think of a culture that was brought down by an invention like a lever, wheel or writing - but we know of civilizations that brought themselves down because they destroyed the ecology of their homes, most famous arguably the Easter Island. So maybe if we look at future and existing technologies, we really need to worry more how they disrupt the ecosystem we live in, not how they might change our day-to-day lives?

  • #44
    can't be bothered Eldorian's Avatar
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    You should read Nick Bostrom's analogy of the urn of invention and the black balls. Basically, the urn is full of balls representing all possible inventions, ideas, ideologies, etc. Balls can be white, meaning only beneficial (for example, the wheel or other simple tools), grey, meaning some positives, some negatives (like nuclear power), or black (meaning just the discovery of it destroys mankind's future). So far, we've only pulled out white and grey balls. But there is the possibility that there are black balls in the urn, and our current policy is simply to pull balls out of the urn as fast as we can. Bostrom gives examples of hypothetical black balls, like what if you could create a nuclear bomb by putting sand in a microwave (which would make cities impossible). Or the possibility of printing doomsday viruses at a home molecular printer. The point is, no technology has been a black ball yet. Strong AI could end up being one, however.

    If you want a quick introduction to Nick Bostrom, he did a talk at google and also was on Sam Harris's podcast recently, both recommended. His book, Superintelligence, is why everyone is talking about doomsday AI recently.

  • #45
    Pony Up! Ovinomancer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Eldorian View Post
    You should read Nick Bostrom's analogy of the urn of invention and the black balls. Basically, the urn is full of balls representing all possible inventions, ideas, ideologies, etc. Balls can be white, meaning only beneficial (for example, the wheel or other simple tools), grey, meaning some positives, some negatives (like nuclear power), or black (meaning just the discovery of it destroys mankind's future). So far, we've only pulled out white and grey balls. But there is the possibility that there are black balls in the urn, and our current policy is simply to pull balls out of the urn as fast as we can. Bostrom gives examples of hypothetical black balls, like what if you could create a nuclear bomb by putting sand in a microwave (which would make cities impossible). Or the possibility of printing doomsday viruses at a home molecular printer. The point is, no technology has been a black ball yet. Strong AI could end up being one, however.

    If you want a quick introduction to Nick Bostrom, he did a talk at google and also was on Sam Harris's podcast recently, both recommended. His book, Superintelligence, is why everyone is talking about doomsday AI recently.
    And it's intellectually weak, as is the black ball argument. It's a repackaging of the precautionary principle, which is a far cry from interesting or new. The urn, example, for instance, fails because the only way to ensure not drawing a black ball (whether they exist or not) is to never draw another ball. It does not matter how carefully you draw balls, if they cannot be told to be black until drawn, the problem is the same in the end. Yet, I haven't heard a suitable method for changing this outcome that doesn't also reframe the problem so that we can tell a ball is black before we finish drawing it and can stop drawing.

    As I said, this is a repackaging of the precautionary principle -- you imagine an outcome that is of uncertain but likely very low probability and then propose policy treats this imagined risk as a high probability event requiring extensive effort to avoid.

    I find his AI concern to be similarly overheated.
    Quote Originally Posted by PWD View Post
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    I think ovi's right.

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